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Jared Grubbs

Butler Bulldogs (3-0) vs Dayton Flyers (3-0) - 11/21

Jared Grubbs, Nov 19, 2018

Settled
  1. Irishdawg

    Irishdawg Banned User VIP Member

    Money:
    $80
    Probably don't beat Ole Miss at home if they didn't allow it. Yes he was bad - but not Baldwin bad.

    The team will continue to grow (I hope) over the course of the season, but I feel pretty confident in saying there's an extremely small chance that Baldwin will leave early.
     
    Tentozen, bu2013, fdr and 5 others like this.
  2. Mark Shelvin

    Mark Shelvin Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $2,032
    One is a pro prospect, one lost his starting spot at George Washington. Which would you rather have taking a poor shot?


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
    Bulldogs322 and AKasle_BU like this.
  3. bu2013

    bu2013 Active Member

    Money:
    $238
    He's as capable of getting the offense going as Kamar, but for sure let's bring up his record under a coach that got fired for being a **** to players

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
    Shimmy, fdr, bwesson15 and 3 others like this.
  4. BulldogPaul

    BulldogPaul Member

    Money:
    $100
    Big problems tonight: We can’t continue to play 3 guards and a small forward. Having both freshman forwards out hurts. It will help to get Tucker eligible. Baldwin has to play off the ball. Tonight AT couldn’t stay on the floor and PJ was in shooting mode. They didn’t get the contributions from Brunk/Fowler they did in the first 3 games. Their first half defense was atrocious.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops
     
    Tentozen and SpartanDawgs like this.
  5. Hinkle Magic2

    Hinkle Magic2 Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $792
    Yeah, we can criticize Jorgensen's shot selection, but he's one of the few--maybe only guys who can consistently put up 20+ ppg game per night other than Baldwin.

    Until we get better ball movement that creates better looks, we have to live with it.
     
    fdr, BHayden and bu2013 like this.
  6. Irishdawg

    Irishdawg Banned User VIP Member

    Money:
    $80
    Right now? Jorgensen. Unless Baldwin gets fouled he's been pretty bad against the only solid (not even good yet) competition they've faced. Jorgensen also takes care of the ball. Extremely small sample size, but it hasn't been encouraging to see how easy he is for teams to defend.
     
  7. ConnersvilleBulldog

    ConnersvilleBulldog Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $5,465
    Had to DVR the game, just caught up.

    Man, one team was playing checkers tonight and one was playing chess. Grant coached circles around LaVall tonight. Really disappointed with the effort and awareness. Probably need to go 2-0 the rest of the tournament now.
     
  8. I Am Butler

    I Am Butler Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $4,132
    Ari? That you?
     
    Tentozen likes this.
  9. I Am Butler

    I Am Butler Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $4,132
    Baldwins shot has always bothered me, but I was able to deal with it because he wasn't the primary option from deep. Watching him take late clock jumpers routinely is going to be painful this year. No idea how you can be an accurate shooter with that long of a stroke.

    LaVall has to design some plays that get McDermott more looks.
     
    BoyGeoff and harvesting like this.
  10. Hinkle Magic2

    Hinkle Magic2 Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $792
    The offense looked like night and day last season between playing Purdue in the Crossroads Classic and Purdue in the NCAA Tournament.

    I'm hoping for some adjustments this year because the status quo has been ugly.

    That being said, we don't have one of the Big East's best pure scorers, Kelan Martin, to run the offense through this time around.

    Maybe Jordan Tucker can carry some of the scoring load, but again short of that...
     
  11. Danville Bulldog

    Danville Bulldog Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $1,081
    PJ's performance against V last year ranks as one of the best. That alone elevates him to a very high level. There is no excuse to bash him on this forum.
     
  12. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $12,695
    Losing this game did not surprise me. Dayton has athletes at every position. We are deficient in quickness and rebounding. We will struggle against athletic teams that play solid defense which is what happened tonight.
     
  13. Jared Grubbs

    Jared Grubbs Administrator Staff Member

    Money:
    $15,994
    Baldwin has taken 31.7% of Butler's shots while on the floor compared to 32% for Jorgensen. Jorgensen has a 119.7 ORating while Baldwin has managed only 100.2. Obviously Kamar gets more of the attention than Jorgensen, but at this point in the season it doesn't make sense to pick on Jorgensen as the reason for any struggles on offense without calling out Baldwin too.
     
    Shimmy, Tentozen, bu2013 and 4 others like this.
  14. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $12,695
    62% of the shots from two players is not good. Where do you find these ratings? What is Sean's?
     
  15. Jared Grubbs

    Jared Grubbs Administrator Staff Member

    Money:
    $15,994
    Those are KenPom stats. Keep in mind that's only when they are in the game, and not total percent. That ranks 83rd and 89th nationally. Having 2 players in the top 100 is probably uncommon. Last year Kelan ranked 81st at 30.8% and Baldwin was 313th at 26.5%. Jorgensen actually doesn't even rank in the top 500 in possessions used though (23.3%), because his turnover rate is so low. Baldwin ranks 14th at 35.3%.
     
  16. Mark Shelvin

    Mark Shelvin Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $2,032
    Kamar obviously needs to be better, but I’m generally fine with his percentage of shots when on the floor. That % for Jorgensen is terrifying to me, but apparently I’m wrong and alone in my opinion.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
  17. Mark Shelvin

    Mark Shelvin Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $2,032
    All fair points, but you are also assuming that the coaching staff will continue utilizing Baldwin in the same horrific way they have thus far. If they do, this season will be a disaster. If Kamar is run off screens without the ball, able to catch the ball while already moving, and we run an offense other than stand and dribble, then the entire analysis changes.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
    bmradio99 likes this.
  18. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $7,073
    Paul’s overall usage is also a lot lower because his assist rate is so low. As annoyed as I am watching PJ sometimes (most of the time?), his efficiency rating is what it is, and the numbers know better than my intuition. He’s been valuable, despite the idiocy of some of the shots.

    The offense has struggled because Kamar has struggled, period. A 100 offensive rating against 4 average to below average opponents is just bad. We just won’t be any good if he’s using 32% of possessions at a 1 point per possession clip.

    But he’ll get better. He’ll turn it over less and he’ll become more accustomed to being the focus. A lot of it is decision making.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
  19. OldSchoolDawg1983

    OldSchoolDawg1983 Active Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $345
    Observations:

    1. Butler is not the first team to lose a Nov holiday tournament game that they were expected to win.

    2. Entering the season, the lack of an athletic big man was probably our biggest concern. TW will not be quickly or easily replaced.

    3. Given #2, we’d have to either score more from the perimeter, or break down an opponent’s defense with motion and screens, creating opportunities for points in the paint and rhythm 3 pt shots.

    4. We don’t win with #3 if we clang shots and dribble in circles. That’s what happened tonight.

    5. We are asking several players who had limited minutes last year to step up into high impact roles this season. Butler basketball is going to be a project until JT and his athleticism arrives for the BE season.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
  20. bu1973

    bu1973 Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $537
    Here are my thoughts on the game:
    1. Baldwin is not nearly as effective when Thompson is off the floor who I thought drew some really ticky-tack fouls. That being said, he has to be more careful.
    2. The offense was terrible, not the shooting because that come and goes at times, but the offense itself. It reminded me of the IU offense under Mike Davis. Pass around the perimeter for 20 seconds and then try to get a shot. Why we did not feed the post, and the rare times we did, why Brunk especially did not go to the basket or at least make a move is beyond me. Cuts need to be hard and with purpose, not just loping from point A to point B.
    3. If you can not create a shot for yourself off the dribble, then you have to move without the ball. One time I remember Baddley made a weakside cut across the lane for an easy lay-up. That was about the hardest cut I saw. I think McD can/should do that because I think he is tall enough to get a shot off in the lane. If you can not dribble to where you want to go, you can always get there without the ball.
    4. Butler is not, and maybe never will be talented enough to not come out hungry for every game. The team that wanted it tonight won the game. Dayton tonight looked like they had far superior talent. I do not think they do, but effort, or in our case, pointless effort, can make things appear that way.
    5. Constantly switching at the perimeter can create some terrible match-ups, especially when you are undersized to begin with.
    6. I thought Dayton was not supposed to be good on the threes but looked pretty good tonight.
    7. We do not have the talent to begin looking for a shot at the 7 second mark of the shot clock.
    8. I rarely criticize coaching but Dayton looked prepared to play and we did not. Scheme is on the coaching, effort is on the players. Both aspects were sorely lacking tonight
     

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