Chuck Harris - What's His Ceiling?

Discussion in 'Butler Basketball' started by BigHoss, Nov 18, 2021.

  1. BigHoss

    BigHoss Well-Known Member

    Among many red flags that were wildly waving in the wind last night, I couldn't help but notice how bad Chuck Harris looked. On top of a poor shooting night, he really struggled to create his own shot, and get past any defender. The only clean 3 he created was when he probably should have been called for an offensive foul.

    I don't want to talk bad about a kid, but I am curious what everyone thinks Chuck's ceiling is.

    Personally, I think some good shooting games on an awful, awful team have unfairly set expectations much too high. I think realistically, on a tournament team, he's a 6th man who can knock down some open 3's here and there, but beyond that I'm not sure I see a ceiling that's much higher. He lacks the athleticism and craftiness that Kamar had to get to the rim and finish, but is also unable to elevate and get his shot off to save a possession. Honestly, I'm not sure that he starts on many Power 5 teams.

    Am I missing something on the hype about him?
  2. Baseline

    Baseline Well-Known Member

    Really like Chuck. He IS NOT a #1 option. He will benefit if he's on the floor with 3-4 other guys WHO CAN SCORE. Last night, we rarely had more than two capable scorers on the floor and MSU knew it. Again, he suffers from the pitiful recruiting of bigs by this staff. The two best bigs were recruited to play in the Horizon League and the MAC.
    bmradio99 likes this.
  3. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

    We shouldn’t expect a sophomore to be the #1 option. The problem is the complete lack of play makers anywhere else on this roster. For having as many upperclassmen as we do, I don’t really trust ANY of them—even Nze (RIP)— to go and get a bucket at the end of the shot clock or make a play when we need it.

    Just look at our 1 and 2 options in past seasons:

    2016– Dunham (sr) and Jones (sr)
    2017– Martin (jr) and Chrabascz (sr)
    2018– Martin (sr) and Baldwin (so)
    2019– Baldwin (sr) and Tucker (jr)
    2020– Baldwin (sr) and McDermott (sr)
    2021– Harris (fr) and Nze? (sr)
    2022– Harris (so) and ???

    What Harris has become is out of necessity because of the lack of upperclassmen development. It’s game 4 of his sophomore season anyways. Unlike sophomore Baldwin, he doesn’t have a Kelan Martin for the defenders to focus on. The fact that he has risen to the occasion from where he was as a HS player is remarkable. People are upset that he had a bad game against MSU but more is being asked of him now than any other underclassman that I can remember. If he’s not going to try to put his team on his back, who else on this roster would you rather take the last shot when time is winding down?
  4. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Kellen his sophomore year comes to mind.

    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops
  5. Ster8462

    Ster8462 Well-Known Member

    Kellen sophomore year was playing against the likes of Michigan State.

    Okay I looked it up and Kellen’s Soph year was or 1st in Big East and we went 14-17 as I believe Rosie was supposed to be an option and of course got hurt so we won like 4 Big East games as we won 10 non-conference games. So Kellen wasn’t able too carry us to great heights until Rose came back and we got more help for him.

    Chuck can drive to the hoop and if we had a motion offense and some bigs with versatility to pull their defenders away from the lane Chuck could finish at rim but now when he gets there he has two bigs rotate and swat the shot to the 3rd row or other option is to pass it to someone who doesn’t have soft hands (I will put it as pleasant as I can) or is still gaining strength.

    There are a lot of weaknesses on our team that a good team like Michigan State exploited.

    Most upsetting thing about Wednesday night other than Mulloy it looked like most every other player took a few to multiple possessions off.

    WE SIMPLY CAN’T HAVE THAT. If we have it and it leads to a under 500 record I think we may need a change at the Top.

    We have had 4 regular season games and in 1/2 the games we had that issue and if that trend continues of every other games we won’t get to 500. If it happens 2-3 more times then likely high NIT or sneaking into NCAA as with the start of the Big East season (not us), but 7-3 against P5 teams we are probably a Top 2 conference and should finish in Top 3 of conferences which means our league gets 6 or 7 in the NCAA tourney.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2021
  6. UDDawg

    UDDawg Well-Known Member

    Kellen's sophomore year was our first in the Big East, BMill's first season.

    I'm pretty concerned by Chuck's seeming lack of athleticism around the rim. Maybe it was just the quality and length of MSU's bigs, but he just never seemed to have a chance at contested layups on Wednesday.
    ButlerProf likes this.
  7. Army Dawg!!!

    Army Dawg!!! Well-Known Member

    I am sorry but I am not understanding this conversation at all. Chuck Harris is a number 1 option. Maybe not for the Duke’s or Kansas’s of the world, but for 90% of the teams he’s a go to guy.
    He is still in the learning phase of his game. Trying to figure out how to be the man even when his shot isn’t falling is huge in the maturation of a #1 guy. He hasn’t figured that part out yet but it’s getting there.

    I really don’t think our players are the problem. I think it’s a development issue. I also think our staff has not done a good job of adjusting or adapting to what they have on the bench. Our 6-8 to 6-10 guys spend more time standing around 3 point line than they do under the basket. I mentioned in another conversation, but at least twice Butler came out of a TV timeout with the ball and turned it over without getting a shot off. Unforced turnovers as well.
    2xDawg, Tentozen, NCJon and 1 other person like this.
  8. Gregory Roach

    Gregory Roach Well-Known Member

    I concur with with Cranjis and Army Dawg, everyone needs to be patient and let this kid develop. One less-than stellar game is simply a bump in the road on the way to his development. There were games were Kelan looked awful and forced shots...he is now an NBA starter. There were games were Baldwin attempted to play hero ball and forgot he had teammates. By the end of his career he was hitting game winners. Give Chuck his due, he is 4 games into a Sophomore season and needs development. Whether this coaching staff can provide all that development is certainly open to a further conversation.
    Army Dawg!!! likes this.
  9. SCbulldogsfan4life

    SCbulldogsfan4life Member

    I think Harris can develop much like McDermott did. Start out being a 3 point specialist and develop other elements of his game as time goes on. Probably won't be as good of a defender/rebounder, but he may become a little more creative offensively than McDermott with time. The problem is that he has to be a focal point of the offense right now, so he can't really progress naturally. We'd all probably be bigger fans if he could just come in and launch open 3's and seize on chances presented to him rather than having to create offense out of nothing.
  10. Ross

    Ross New Member

    Really wish covid would’ve waited a month
    NCJon likes this.
  11. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    If Harris is not as good of a defender as Sean we’re in loads of trouble.

    Almost no chance he’s as good of a rebounder though. Sean had awesome instincts.

    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops

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