Game Thread: Butler vs. Purdue (12/18)

Discussion in 'Butler Basketball' started by ConnersvilleBulldog, Dec 16, 2021.

  1. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

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    Can they also get COVID losses? Otherwise I may need to renegotiate.
     
  2. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    Well if Butler’s play is any indication, that variant will be a giant loser and won’t beat anyone, so let’s hope this happens. With such a weak performance by a variant, we may finally end this Covid nightmare!
     
  3. willisbrown

    willisbrown Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    Ha...good point. I'm afraid covid will be a thing ongoing and we're just gonna have to learn to keep on our toes and deal. But yes, I would prefer a variant that represents the play of Butler on the court. Would be no different than getting the sniffles.
     
  4. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    Good points for sure. I’m not anymore pleased with what is on the floor than you. I was in Vegas and made an ass out of myself yelling at Golden. The lack of effort was incredible.

    However for sake of discussion when there are 2,000 transfers then losing two doesn’t seem to be out of the ordinary when it comes to retention. We lost a third to a rape. Loved to have kept both for sure and the third one hadn’t done what he supposedly did. At some schools he’d still be on the team. I guess you could argue he can’t recruit when he recruited Coles, Johnson and Battle and couldn’t retain Coles and Battle.

    Personally I don’t believe this season would have been a dumpster fire had Nze and Hodges not been hurt and AT hadn’t been suspended which surely set back his game preparation. Yes we would have still lost to Purdue as will virtually every other college but by a smaller margin. And similarly to Michigan State and Houston. But we would have beaten Texas A&M followed by Notre Dame. As for next year there again will be 2,000 transfers and probably a lot more than that will be available. On the other hand college coaches are going to be poaching rosters if they haven’t already started. Doubt Jordan will which along with NIL could be the end of whatever aspirations we all have. Not mentioned is the possibility that this season will be cancelled again anyway because of omicron. Talk about another dumpster fire.

    I too wished Stevens had stayed and had goals in life that were more similar to those of Mark Few, Scott Drew and Jay Wright but he didn’t. For sure they have all been approached to move on but chose to stay where they are and build something special.
     
  5. butlerguy03

    butlerguy03 Well-Known Member

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    North Carolina lost by 29 to Kentucky on national TV and nearly gave up 100. Teams have bad seasons, some posters have made this board look like an IU board with unrealistic expectations.
     
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  6. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    ‘I’m shocked by it’: Kentucky clobbering, worst loss in 10 seasons leaves UNC searching

     
  7. BigHoss

    BigHoss Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    This attitude will turn us into the next DePaul.

    It’s one thing to have a bad season. It’s another to have consecutive bad seasons, with the program trajectory arrow pointing sharply downward.
     
  8. Baddog

    Baddog Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, if after 4 1/2 years of witnessing Butler basketball digress under Jordan and you're still defending him, you just may be as clueless about the game as much as Jordan is about what it takes to be a head coach. Just saying.
     
  9. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. And that’s frustrating for sure. I too thought that with everyone back they could be a tournament team. We would likely be 8-3, and at least split the conference. Being a tournament team and then losing 5-6 players is enticing for transfers to fill that void. With injuries, the opportunity to turn this program around to an extent is slipping away. My fear is that we won’t be competitive in the transfer market with cupboards so bare and future so bleak but people transfer for a myriad of reasons and playing on national television every night in the big east doesn’t hurt.

    We’ve seen that LJ CAN recruit talent. But that retention is an equal part of it. Obviously Scooby was a freakin bomb that exploded and we’ll never quite know why the others transferred— was it like they said and wanted to be closer to home, or did they see something in the program that would limit their development? It is LJ and the staff’s responsibility to protect their recruiting investments as much as they can. We are seeing the repercussions this year (injuries) and next. Can you imagine how much better our team would be had Battle and Coles still been here? Battle was averaging 21 point before he blew his knee this season. Harris and JT could play in secondary and tertiary roles and let the games come to them more. Coles could be a respectable replacement for Nze.
     
  10. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    We need to sticky post the scholarship chart so it’s the first thing every poster sees when they come to ButlerHoops


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  11. znelson15

    znelson15 Well-Known Member

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    The teams we have lost to are teams that is ok to lose to actually.

    They have all been top quality athletic teams with nba players and are well coached by top tier coaches.

    For me it’s how badly we have lost to them which as a butler fan I am not use to losing to teams like this.




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  12. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    This is where I am. There’s no loss we have that bothers me at face value. I believe, however, that TAMU was the only loss in which I’m which we were remotely competitive. Even then I think we trailed by 19 or 17 early.

    Yesterday I actually do think we were ready to play. The coach then took the best player off the floor when it was obvious the best player was the only reason we were in the game.


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  13. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    Big east presents a clean slate so to speak. Once Hodges and Nze come back I’m expecting a few growing pains. But if we continue to play as bad as we have midway through BigEast play with everyone back and healthy, I might just lose my ****.


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  14. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

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    I saw Barry Collier at the Maui Classic in Vegas and he was sitting next to an ex -player who is a major donor to the program who I will not mention by name. I’d imagine neither was happy with the product on the floor.

    Collier told be then that Tate and Hodges would not be back until the new year and Nze was out for between 4-8 weeks. He told me Hodges broke his leg in a pick up game. Apparently the break has healed but the calf and back of his leg muscles still need to heal. Collier was wrong on Tate as he is back but a long way from being of much help.
     
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  15. ap234

    ap234 Active Member

    Money:
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    Nothing LJ has done tells me he can recruit at the level it takes to win in Big East. Since the roster has turned over to mostly his players last year and this year the product has gotten worse. If a player transfers and then becomes decent that doesn’t mean he would’ve been that good at Butler. LJ is a low major or assistant coach trying to be a Big East head coach. He’s also only got one commit for 2022. That’s not the results you see out of a good recruiter.
     
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  16. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    I guess I should rephrase. I thought he WAS a good recruiter up until the last 2 years. 2019 had Battle and he’s done well plus Tucker transfer (McD all American). 2020 was the monster 5-man class with Scooby mr basketball, 2021 was mediocre with all local products and yeah 2022 is Brandon Miller-esque except our staff went all out and came up empty vs Miller just stopped all together.

    But if I take my blue-colored glasses off and actually look at how we compare with other big east schools, the best we’ve done in LJ’s tenure is 6th best recruiting class— that’s bottom half of the league (2018-9th, 2019-6th, 2020-6th, 2021-9th, 2022-10th). Not only that but we’ve only had one 4-star recruit according to 247 and he isn’t even with the team anymore (Battle, ESPN top 100). So yeah I take it back.


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  17. butlerguy03

    butlerguy03 Well-Known Member

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    Basing coaching ability off recruitment rankings might be the most IU thing I’ve ever heard. Sure, the top 5-10 are pretty easy, but beyond that, the rankings are completely stupid. No one can rank the top 20 in Marion County without major debate, let alone the nation. What exactly makes a guy #86 vs #104? #205 vs #189?
     
  18. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't Tate a top 100? Was 2021 mediocre? Taylor seems to be the real deal and JD has surprised. Connor Turnbull is having monstrous stats. For what it is worth Zack Edey of Purdue was ranked 440.
     
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  19. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    Okay guy— My only point was we all thought LJ was a decent recruiter, myself included. But if you try to look at it objectively we aren’t so great. I get that rankings are subjective in itself but how else do you evaluate how your coaches are recruiting vs other schools in the conference? I’m honestly curious how you would go about evaluating how our recruiting stacks up to others, especially if it is supposedly one of our coach’s strengths. It’s the only quantifiable data I can point to.

    Obviously our 2008 recruiting class was the GOAT and didn’t reflect in the ranking so I see your point.


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  20. Cranjis McBasketball

    Cranjis McBasketball Well-Known Member

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    Tate was #176 on 247sports, 2021 has 2 players who we were planning to redshirt. JT looks good but I think his minutes will be eaten up a bit with Hodges back. He will contribute a bunch in the future though and I think it’s something we can build around. I was actually more excited to see PT this season that JT but it’s obvious JT is further along. So I think it was a good but not great/bad class. I got burned by watching Cooper Neese stuff the stat sheet a few years ago so I try to look at AAU numbers and Turnbull averaged 5ppg on the EYBL circuit. He looks much better than JMM though and seems to be doing well in Class 6 basketball compared to cooper being I think 2A? It’s hard to judge 6’11” guys in HS games because more times than not, the tallest guy on the other team is 4-6 inches shorter. For example JMM averaged 15 and 9 at Carmel his senior year and I remember watching the championship thinking there was potential there (still do in certain situations).

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    Last edited: Dec 19, 2021
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