Kebba Njie - 2022 Forward (Penn State)

Discussion in 'Recruiting Archive' started by Lukas Harkins, Jun 11, 2021.

  1. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    I actually am also curious as to why. I would guess because it’s not considered a research institution? Not saying that’s accurate, but that’s my guess as to classification.

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  2. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    US News & World Report has historically ranked schools as "national" or "regional" universities based on how robust their graduate programs are. According to US News, "national" universities have a significant number of graduate programs, including PhD options, while "regional" universities typically only offer masters or maybe a limited number of PhD.

    Butler is ranked No. 1 in the Midwest for regional universities. There are four regions.. Penn State is ranked #63 in national universities.

    Frankly, I suspect the quality of undergraduate education is probably pretty comparable between the two, although the experience is likely quite different. The top ranked regional schools are pretty much on par with a mid-tier national university.
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  3. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    I’d imagine Penn State’s best programs are far, far better than Butler’s best because of the resources they have.

    But back at the median I think almost every Butler student likely receives a quality education. Never been enrolled at a state school but I’d think it would be pretty easy to matriculate there without putting a lot in or getting a lot out. I think Butler excels at preventing that.

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  4. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

    Thanks. That’s helpful and makes sense.

    My mom is a retired prof. One of the things she told me that’s 100% true is that education is what you make of it. You can get a good experience anywhere if you buy in.

    But the big difference is… a Penn State degree holds weight around the country. My mom’s university is good for a small school - a degree from there holds weight in my home town but really nowhere else. I’d assume the same for Butler. A Butler degree means something in Indy and maybe other areas around the state, but really nowhere else.

    That’s honestly the value of a degree. How much ppl care about it to give you opportunities.
  5. Irishdawg

    Irishdawg Banned User

    FWIW, Creighton, who Butler tied with as the best Midwest University before Creighton moved to the National University category is ranked #103. So Penn State has a better overall academic profile, but it's not a massive chasm IMO, and probably a wholly different experience overall to where it's more preference in terms of what you're looking for as an undergrad.
  6. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    I’d agree with this for a butler degree. It’s meaning depends on how familiar someone is with butler……which reminds me…..INVEST IN THE BASKETBALL PROGRAM

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  7. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    What I’ve quoted below from Jon is right - Butler is not on the “national universities” list because it’s almost exclusively an undergrad college, so it’s apples and oranges to try to glean anything about the education itself from a rankings perspective. As an extreme example, everyone who knows anything about academia knows Amherst students get a better education than probably anyone else, but you’re never going to see them ranked next to Harvard by USNWR. I have no idea what the undergrad experience is like at Penn State, but I’m about as familiar with Purdue’s undergrad as one can be without having gone there, and I’m confident in saying that the undergrad education for the average student at PU is materially worse. If it were somehow quantifiable, I’d bet my life on it. (Anecdotally, my friends in grad school who went to undergrad-oriented colleges uniformly outperformed those who went to similarly regarded “national” universities.)

    One other thing I want to point out about the USNWR university rankings is that their methodology puts nearly 50% of its weight on “reputation” and faculty pay/resources, each of which I’d argue is almost entirely based on the strength of the graduate programs. So using these rankings to argue about undergrads is kind of pointless. Again, the Amherst example.

    I get what you’re saying about Penn State - way, way more people are familiar with it - but I’m really not sure how much that familiarity translates in a meaningful way to the job market. When most people think Penn State, they think football and the Big Ten and partying. That’s the reality. And again, anecdotally, my Butler friends have had an easy time getting high paying jobs around the country (literally from coast to coast, much to my chagrin), so it certainly doesn’t seem the relative lack of familiarity has hamstrung anyone I know.

    Sent from my iPhone, so it’s probably not written all that well
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
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  8. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

    This article is old, but it still applies. This is what I mean in terms of having a PSU degree. I doubt a Butler degree will hurt anyone, but the PSU degree gives a couple built-in advantages. Especially in big job markets like NYC and for jobs in finance and stuff. I got stopped 3x walking into MSG at the 2018 BET by people asking me where Butler is. PSU being recognizable and having a brand helps.


    Here’s an updated article -

    Of course PSU commissioned the study lol. But whether deserved or not, sometimes perception is reality.
  9. knobcreekfan

    knobcreekfan Well-Known Member

    I once thought the average Butler grad was smarter than the average person. Then I started reading this board. /s

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  10. Ster8462

    Ster8462 Well-Known Member

    So as I was trying to see if there was any tea leaves out there I went to Brian Snow’s account as he used to be a good guy to follow back 3 years ago. Had forgot he took the Recruiting Director at Penn State gig not long ago.

    No tea leaves to be had as I would expect for someone in that position but again a reminder of difference (advantages of larger school recruiting). Penn State has a position for Director of Basketball Recruiting.

    Let’s go and somehow bring this guy to Butler. Basketball is top Dawg on our campus and with the following for 3 years after this one I like or chances to get to the 2nd weekend once or twice and maybe even to the final weekend one of the years.

    No one screams out one or two and done so if we can keep a core 7 of these guys together it could be another pretty special time in BU basketball.

    1/2: 1)Tate, 2)Harris, 3)Taylor

    2/3: 1)Thomas, 2)Lukosius, 3)Taylor

    3/4: 1)Hughes, 2)Wilmoth, 3)Turnbull

    4/5: 1)Njibe, 2)Wilmoth, 3)Mulloy

    Golden still available next year but more done with 2023-2024 and beyond in mind.

    Think if these guys develop and we add a couple more useable pieces we have very talented team with a lot of interchangeable parts.

    Okay I will try to get some work done on this Friday.
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  11. butlerguy03

    butlerguy03 Well-Known Member

    Part of this is that Penn State has been regarded as a "Power" athletic program for over 100 years...Butler about 10. Butler's inclusion into the Big East is VERY important to more than just basketball. To be mentioned in the same conference as Georgetown means something. The fact that they agreed to associate themselves with Butler means something as well.
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  12. TheDawgDub95

    TheDawgDub95 Well-Known Member VIP Member

    The longer this stays quiet, the more it starts to *feel* like a "Butler" recruit. We didn't even know he was doing an OV to Butler until days after it had already occurred... Happy tea leaves reading in the meantime.

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  13. seadawg

    seadawg Well-Known Member VIP Member

    This academic debate is somewhat fruitless and I regret not specifying my meaning. Obviously PSU is a great institution and has much wider variety of areas to offer than BU especially in the area of post graduate studies. On the hand, BU has several very strong, highly respected fields of study academically for undergrads. It would be worth noting, only if a recruit had a specific field they wanted to explore. That said, many students may only have general ideas of interest upon admission. JMO
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  14. Ster8462

    Ster8462 Well-Known Member

    First Crystal to Penn State with a confidence of 5.
  15. Lukas Harkins

    Lukas Harkins Well-Known Member

    This is pretty much how I feel right now too. My gut says Penn State but I honestly have no clue at this point. As close to the vest of a recruitment as I have followed in the past two years for Butler. Wouldn't be shocked if he's a Dawg but I'd lean PSU with fairly low confidence. (Raising my confidence... :()
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2021
  16. ButlerGoalie

    ButlerGoalie Well-Known Member

    Legitimate question: If this plays out to PSU and Reed goes elsewhere, would the 2022 class be considered a complete failure? Sure, we nabbed potential in Connor, but we didn't get any of our priority recruits and there really didn't seem to be much of strategy to this class.

    Sure, all caveats to transfers since I know that's how many of you will respond, but Butler hasn't really shown much ability to land game-changing top talent in the transfer portal. Sure, they are good at getting complimentary pieces, but there's a real hole down low once Golden leaves and our PG depth is suspect. LJ "lost" two pieces out of the much-ballyhooed 2020 class and the 2021 class remains to be seen, but the trends are troubling and for whatever reason, we can't land our targets. We need to do better to even be top-half Big East, let alone competing for the crown where most of us would hope Butler would aim for.
  17. Ster8462

    Ster8462 Well-Known Member

    Not a total washout because I really include the foreign player in this class so we got 2 of 5 high priority guys we targeted.

    Grade C but don’t feel our coaches weren’t doing their best. As Brad Stevens said you are never as good or as bad as your last game but appearance is everything.

    Most recruits see Butler as 8-12 last year and don’t see we were playing with 7 healthy bodies some of the year. They also only remember if they even do that Butler has been to the Tourney 1 time in Jordan’s 4 years. Of course we know it was two years but in today’s world most people don’t see the big picture.

    Penn State and Boston College have shiny new coaches talking a good game and Butler has Jordan that most recruits don’t see as producing a ton of winning. I think we do very well this season and that image changes and we are one big away from being in the tourney for 3-4 years running even if it means finding another under the radar Bryce Nze guy for 2 years.

    Im still very optimistic on the ability of Jordan and staff to recruit just had somethings out of their control this year.

    Not ready to say Kebba to PSU is a done deal however but if that is they way it goes it will be important to get to tourney this year and then Jordan can say we’ve been in 3 of last 5 and an NIT and think that looks pretty favorable.
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  18. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Forever and ever amen

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  19. ConnersvilleBulldog

    ConnersvilleBulldog Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Losing back-to-back recruiting battles to BC and Penn St would be a pretty big kick in the nads.

    The silver lining is the transfer portal has completely changed the game and made it possible to completely reverse recruiting misses.
  20. willisbrown

    willisbrown Well-Known Member

    Getting one project big is not a good class, no. But I think it's still in motion and that the shift has come to be more and more focused on transfers. Do I love that? Not as a whole strategy but it's just the changing in times we're seeing. I would have loved to have landed our top targets but it didn't happen. Got to hope for a strong year on the court and a couple hits in the transfer market...and hopefully become more serious recruiting players for the 2023s. This 22 cycle has been underwhelming, and on the heels of losing two good players from the 2020 class, it's tough to have patience/confidence. I'm trying to in the hopes there is big splash with a couple transfers in the spring. (or hell mid year).

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