Kyle Young - 2017 Forward (Flip - Ohio St.)

Discussion in 'Recruiting Archive' started by Jared Grubbs, Sep 3, 2015.

  1. seadawg

    seadawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $3,282
    I like Doyle and college basketball is the area he excels . You may disagree with his opinion. You may think there was tampering by CH. You may hate the parties involved. There may well have been channels of indirect communication. Losing KY is a sore spot but he's gone regardless of why. BU's loss. OSU's gain. I don't like it but we need to remember there is a human side to the story and Doyle merely explained it as he perceived it.
     
  2. Mark Shelvin

    Mark Shelvin Well-Known Member

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    I think we actually are in agreement that if Doyel was reporting anything objectively in his article (which he's not), then he would have said that although Holtmann may not have directly contacted Young since the initial call (btw, would be interested to see what was actually said in that call), indirect lines of communication were almost assuredly in place and that is reflected in public comments made by Young's high school coach.

    Also, the notion that a regular college student wouldn't feel any negative repercussions for switching to a different college this late in the game is disingenuous. I had a drop dead date to choose a law school, or else all my scholarship money was gone. My wife changed colleges 1 semester in, and paid 18K more per year for the rest of her tenure than she would have if she had decided to go to that school originally because they rescinded her academic scholarship money. Nobody is saying Young shouldn't be able to go to OSU, but the PC notion that "oh, a regular student can go anywhere without any sort of penalty" is a crock.
     
  3. Dawgedd

    Dawgedd Well-Known Member

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    To be clear: we should talk about the 2018 class (and competition with OSU and other teams for those kids). However, Young is gone and its better to move on and focus on our upcoming year, 2018 recruits, and beyond
     
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  4. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

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    I think that Mark Shelvin's point is that even if we "move on" and focus on the 2018 recruits, those 2018 recruits we would be focusing on, we are recruiting them against a guy who was recruiting them now for OSU, but on Butler's watch. What you're suggesting is like having a player leave to go to another school, and now you only play against that school, every game. They are impossible to separate for quite a while. We are trying to get guys who the coach of another school established a relationship with on the pretenses that it was to benefit us, now we get significantly more harmed by it than if he had never recruited those guys to begin with.
     
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  5. Mark Shelvin

    Mark Shelvin Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $1,994
    I would add that this Young fiasco is (a) still fresh and (b) the most recent example of what will assuredly be several overly frustrating moments with relation to the former staff in the next 2-3 years.
     
  6. seadawg

    seadawg Well-Known Member

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    I agree but it is a done deal. It will not change. Let's move on. This whole topic got soured quickly.
     
  7. Albick

    Albick Well-Known Member

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    I think Doyel totally missed the point. I perceive little animus toward KY here. He was presented with a difficult decision and made a reasonable one under the circumstances. I believe most of the vitriol is directed at CH, who was responsible for taking our head coach, all three of our assistant coaches, and our top recruit (as well as the relationships with 2018s and 2019s who were in the pipeline) well after the time when our coaching options would be plentiful and just before the most critical period for 2018 recruiting, all while acting as if he cared a whit about what happened to Butler in the process and hoped to minimize the damage. That aspect wasn't addressed at all by Doyel who. unfortunately, has very obviously become a Holtmann apologist. Of course we knew that CH could move on to another school some day (although we had hoped that we had found our Mark Few), but didn't really see it coming in such a repugnant and hypocritical manner from a man that many of us (perhaps naively) thought had more integrity. Lesson learned.
     
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  8. Dawgedd

    Dawgedd Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. CH is also a warning that unless some aspects of the basketball program change, we will continue to be a stepping stone. Sure, LaVall (unlike CH) has a Butler connection, but he also has connections elsewhere and at bigger schools with more resources (Michigan). I think LaVall was the best pick and I hope he is Butler's Few. But I think that depends in a lot of ways on decisions the AD makes in the next several years regarding facilities, recruiting budget, and overall investment in the program. Otherwise, I will be on pins and needles every offseason
     
  9. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I thought Brad Stevens was our Mark Few. Never believed Chris Holtmann was our Mark Few. You don't leave a HC job at GW to be an assistant at Butler unless you see something big coming down the road. CH is not the person we all were led to believe he was. Mark Few is a different kind of guy and unique among HC. The Big football schools and state schools with huge amounts of money will always be able to buy our coaches. Look at the past twenty years. Just something we need to get used to.
     
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  10. BullDawg2789

    BullDawg2789 Active Member

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    I agree, and I also never thought Holtmann was our Mark Few. But I wouldn't say "the person we all were led to believe he was," more like the person "we wanted to believe he was."


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  11. shoeevv

    shoeevv Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
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    I was going to write the same thing. An Ohio high school coach and a recruiting service guy both said Young told LJ he was not coming and was asked not to announce until LJ had resecured the other 4 commitments.
     
  12. HoosierDawg

    HoosierDawg Member

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    Sincerely hope it goes just as well for tosu.



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  13. peeps112

    peeps112 Well-Known Member

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    Holt and Pedon were like father figures to Kyle. Even if Holt told him to stay at BU, Kyle likely would have wanted to follow them. I would have loved to have him, but we need to move past this.


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  14. Insane Dawg

    Insane Dawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I would venture to say Holtmann's first call after he accepted the OSU job was to Kyle Young if not directly then through a back channel. But I also agree Pedon and CH were surrogate fathers to him. KY chose BU because of them and then chose OSU because of them. It never was about Butler.
     
  15. schoops

    schoops Active Member

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    I'm not sure who is expressing animosity towards Young. I have none, and I haven't seen anyone disparaging him on here. I feel badly for the kid having been put in this situation. My issues are 100% with Holtman, the assistant coaches, and the Ohio State athletic director....just shady.
     
  16. Baddog Sucks

    Baddog Sucks New Member

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    NLI RECRUITING BAN:

    Cease communication: Once a prospective student-athlete signs an NLI, all NLI member institutions and conferences must cease contact with the NLI signee and his or her family members. Any contact in excess of an exchange of a greeting would result in an NLI Recruiting Ban Violation regardless of the conversation. The conversation does not have to result in a recruiting discussion for a violation to occur. It is understandable that a coach from another institution, due to the relationship established during the recruiting process, may want to call or send a note to congratulate the prospective student-athlete for signing his or her NLI. This exchange is permissible but must be timely following the date of signing and must not be more than the congratulatory dialogue.

    Initiated by NLI signee: If communication is initiated by the NLI signee, the coach is obligated to ask if the student has signed an NLI and proceed to inquire with the compliance staff to see if an NLI has been signed. The coach should cease communication until the student’s NLI status is determined by the compliance staff.
     
  17. Eric

    Eric Well-Known Member

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    Does Doyel have the same agent as CH? The columns he's been writing lately have read more like something a PR firm has put out than a supposedly objective sports columnist.


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  18. HoosierPal

    HoosierPal Member

    Money:
    $51
    Let's see if Kyle Young turns out to be a better player than Nolan Berry. Both were ranked in the same general region on various recruiting services while in HS. While not the same skill set, they have similarities (besides being white). There is a weak link in every recruiting class, there are transfers out of every recruiting class. Give this situation a couple of years and then revisit.
     
  19. peeps112

    peeps112 Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $526
    My last comment on this is that Young will likely be a very good player, but I don't think he is a good fit next to Brunk long term. Need defense and rim protection. He will be good for OSU though. Now let's get us Bigham or another long 4 in 2018.


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  20. Red1972

    Red1972 Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $970
    Holtmann gave Doyel more time than Archie Miller. Doyel going on about how good Kyle Young is disturbing considering he never saw Young play, must have been talking
    to Holtmann and Pedon. How does he possibly know anything about Butler's four other recruits having never seen any them play except for Neese.
     

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