Marquette Golden Eagles (8-9, 4-7) vs Butler Bulldogs (5-9, 4-7), Tuesday, 2/2, 5:00 PM EST (FS1)

Discussion in 'Butler Basketball' started by ButlerNut, Jan 30, 2021.

  1. ButlerAlumDad716

    ButlerAlumDad716 Active Member VIP Member

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    Sadly the role of a pass first point guard at BU no longer exists without a dominant big or deadly 3pt shooter.
     
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  2. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I mostly agree. He's a great dawg and a huge net positive for Butler for his overall career, but if you lack shooters and the rest of the team just isn't very good defensively, you simply can't have a point guard who is unable to shoot - at all - and expect the results to be very good. It's pretty much coaching malpractice to guard him outside of 12 feet.

    Relatedly - and this applies to more of our players than just AT - I will just never understand how guys can play basketball their entire lives and cannot shoot even a free throw. It's completely mind-boggling. The amount of coordination it takes to do what these guys do with their handle, passing, defense, body control, etc., and then just to look like a 3rd grade AAU team at the free throw line - it's just truly mind boggling.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2021
  3. Ignatius J. Reilly

    Ignatius J. Reilly Well-Known Member

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    Something I've genuinely kicked around -- what's the line where you ask if AT or Nze would have been better off if they shot underhanded?
     
  4. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $10,862
    If you’re shooting under 60% over multiple seasons, you probably ought to try something else.
     
  5. TheDawgDub95

    TheDawgDub95 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I think AT's wrist or thumb is affecting him because there were times earlier this year when he realized he just needed to assert his will and we could have used that against X and Marquette.

    How nice would it be if our bigs could just quickly punch it when they have an angle to the rim because Bo is going to draw doubles on his drives. He should also be able to create kick outs to shooters or as Dickie (cringe) called it, the one more pass for a shot.

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  6. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

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    I think Jordan Tucker actually is the closest, but clearly Hodges seems to be stronger and is obviously much tougher and instinctive.

    The challenge for Hodges is that despite him being really good at what he does, he truly has to be *excellent* at what he does in order for him to be really efficient. With how bad of a 3 point and free throws shooter he is, he has to be pretty solidly above 50% on two’s in order for him to be actually a net plus to scoring efficiency.


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  7. ButlerNut

    ButlerNut Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    He's a 40%+ shooter from 3. He had a good look. I just wish it didn't come down to that shot...so many layups missed.
     
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  8. UDDawg

    UDDawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    Bolden is tied with Zegarowski among Big East players for most 3PFG made all season, and has 6 games of 4+ made threes. What is torching to you?
     
  9. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I think with Hodges you have a bit more flexibility here because he seems like he can guard. It’s important to remember though that Thompson is an incredible defender and despite his deficiencies, our third leading scorer.

    After the Creighton game teams started to gear up for what he did specifically. If you watch the UCONN game they guarded ball screens set for him differently than they did everyone else. While it was effective, it also indicates a degree of respect of the threat he can pose.

    I actually think the answer to mitigate his deficiencies is to play him off the ball more. It’s much harder to run isolation actions for him when he’s got the ball than when he doesn’t. I feel pretty good about him driving one on one, especially when he’s very adept at passing if it isnt there.


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  10. ButlerNut

    ButlerNut Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
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    The Free Throw shooting sucked (and has for the season).

    The Dawgs missed 12 FT last night. But Marquette missed 11
    Dawgs had only 9 TO. Marquette had 21.

    The main story of the game is this.
    Dawgs were 12 of 31 on 2 point attempts. 38%!
    Marquette was 20 of 27 on 2 point attempts. 74%

    There's your ballgame.

    Dawgs gotta learn how to finish at the rim.
     
  11. SnoopDawg

    SnoopDawg Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    With how well he can finish with his right hand and do floaters at the rim, perhaps he should shoot free-throws with his right as a chance to completely change his form. I personally can shoot as well with my left hand from the line as my right (70-80%).
     
  12. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    I don’t think this an awful idea, but personally I worry about the mental effects of doing something like this.

    People in Indiana will probably remember Nojel Eastern from Purdue-big athletic guard, couldn’t shoot at all.

    In high school he was actually a pretty good shooter, I thought it was a strength. His senior year he got the yips and started trying to shoot free throws righty. He stopped being able to shoot from anywhere after that experiment.


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  13. bmradio99

    bmradio99 Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    I hear you, but it's also about percentage. Jair Bolden has attempted more 3s (115!) than anyone in the conference, including Creighton notables Mitch Ballock (114), Denzel Mahoney (113), and Zegarowski (106). (Jesus, Creighton shoots a lot of 3s.) He's a 38% 3pt shooter. Definitely Big East caliber. But he's no more of a 'sure thing' from deep than several other guys in the league. (And he was 100% the right guy to take that shot. He just missed. Happens.)
    http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/conferences/statistics/player/_/id/4/stat/3-points
    https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/conferences/big-east/2021-stats.html
     
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  14. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    You have to consider the quality of looks too though, and Bolden gets very, very poor quality looks unless there is a breakdown.




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  15. BUcheer

    BUcheer Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Agree with all of this, but you can overcome the “split second extra before defense arrives” with good passes in the right spot, being ready for the ball (hesitation) and (most infuriatingly) bringing the ball down after the catch or onto the floor.
     
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  16. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    You can mitigate it with good fundamental, yes. No doubt we can do a better job mitigating it than we have.


    Given how little we struggled last year relatively to this year (for example Nze leading conference in fg%), it shows that the big guys are literally capable of being successful and productive.

    While it’s collective-I think looking at the team as a whole rather than just the guys missing the shots probably gets us closer to correctly identifying the problem, rather than the symptom.





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  17. Al_

    Al_ Member

    Money:
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    Butler's coaching staff is a joke. If and when LaVall gets fired, I'm sure one of his coaching buddies will throw him a life line and he will end up as an assistant with another D1 program. As for Kampen, and Lowery, nobody will throw life lines out to either one. My guess is that both will either end up selling insurance, in pharmaceutical sales or coaching a high school freshman basketball team. Take your pick. Butler needs to hire someone that has that kenpom type experience. I vote for Ricky Bobby!
     
  18. butlerguy03

    butlerguy03 Well-Known Member

    Money:
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    Few thoughts after thinking about this game yesterday:

    1. Hodges is the best player at Butler
    2. Our offense is broken because the two PG's can't shoot and pull the defense out.
    3. Nze would be a great collegiate stretch 4 in the right situation with a dominate big man.
    4. LaVall Jordan seemed to be working the refs a bit more yesterday.
    5. This team needs to run for open shots. That should include adding more full or 3/4 press.
    6. More Reggie Miller set plays (multiple screens) for Bolden early in the game would be nice to see.
     
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  19. WDLTH

    WDLTH Member VIP Member

    Money:
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    How about a right handed floater for his free throws. Get the ball, take a few steps back and put up the floater. Can't be worse than his current average. Kidding of course......maybe.
     
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  20. WDLTH

    WDLTH Member VIP Member

    Money:
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    Not someone previously in a Butler uniform, but I get some Zion vibes. NO, he's not as good as Zion, but he lurks a bit like him, and a bit unassuming, then explodes (obviously not as explosive as Zion, but it's fun to watch).
     

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