NCAA Tournament conversation

Discussion in 'Around the League' started by ThaddeusB, Mar 17, 2016.

  1. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $9,585
    The death penalty is not on the table. Those of you hoping for it, well, bless your hearts.

    A postseason ban in men's basketball is possible, but unlikely. Same for football because they already served one from the related, earlier case that caused this mess to come to light. Women's hoops, on the other hand, is much more likely to get a postseason ban.

    Expect the women's team to bear the brunt of the punishments that aren't athletic department-wide. There are no direct allegations against men's basketball or football in the NOA, and in the supporting documentation men's basketball is the least culpable of the three.

    The NCAA will have to come up with a deservedly harsh punishment, but will have a hard time justifying a post season ban on men's basketball based on the evidence. Of course that's what all the armchair quarterbacks want because they haven't looked into what actually happened - who knew what, when - and just know that a horrible thing happened at UNC and men's hoops is the marquee program so clearly it deserves the punishment.
     
  2. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $9,585
    Two of the principal figures in the case actually were charged with fraud crimes. The prosecutor dropped the charges in order to induce them to cooperate with university's external investigation. Would have made for a fascinating criminal trial and I'm still pissed the charges were dropped, even though their cooperation helped reveal the details of how the scam worked.
     
  3. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $13,960
    Wow. Just read a tidbit on it. Maybe the whole situation is worse than I thought (though while I agree harsh punishment is in order, I still think accepting money for teaching a class that doesn't exist is nowhere near death-penalty-worthy).
     
  4. bumba

    bumba Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $10,292
     
  5. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $9,585
    I never said it was a UNC thing, or that it wasn't about cheating. But in part because its my alma mater, and in part because of my day job, I have paid close attention to the scandal, having read both of the independent reports commissioned by the university, as well as the NCAA's Notice of Allegations and supporting documentation, along with hundreds of other records that have been made public as part of the scandal.

    The Committee on Infractions will have to make its punishment decisions based on the 5 major violations alleged in the NOA, which surprisingly did not allege academic misconduct but treated the classes as an impermissible benefit. None of those allegations are against men's basketball, although men's hoops is connected to the lack of institutional control claim.

    Since you brought up McCants, it's important to understand that it wasn't his entire junior year that he was only enrolled in these classes. It was the spring semester, which was also his final semester, and not one for determining academic eligibility. I've publicly advocated for UNC to voluntarily abdicate the '05 title because it's clearly tainted. But it's not clear at all that the NCAA can establish under its rules that any of the players were academically ineligible. Just because a player may have had a "paper class" in a previous semester does not automatically mean he's academically ineligible. You have to go to each player's transcript and recalculate GPA without that class.

    McCants talked openly about it to the press for a few months, but he steadfastly refused to cooperate with either the NCAA's investigator or the independent investigators the university hired. He did make some overtures about the university settling any potential claims with him for several million and now his sister is actively suing the university. So much of what you heard him talk about on OTL, or elsewhere, isn't in the NCAA's NOA or supporting documentation.

    He's also not one of the 10 athletes that the NCAA has alleged exceeded the university's 12 hour cap on independent studies courses because the university falsely asserted that the cap did not come into existence until 2006, after McCants was gone.

    If you read the NOA, you'll see that the NCAA was careful not to single out men's basketball or football, but rather it was an athletic department-wide issue. Take that for what you will, but many involved in these kinds of cases take that as a signal that the punishment is going to be athletic department-wide, with the exception of women's hoops which was directly implicated because its academic adviser was knee deep in the mess.
     
  6. WestLoopDog

    WestLoopDog Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $3,907
    I read the article on the home page about the $$$ awarded to the conferences and individual schools. This raised the question in my mind. Did Butler receive the $2.04MM this year or was that the total that former Big East teams (e.g., Nova, St. Johns, G'town) received because the payments go back 6 years? Can anyone shed some light on this?
     
  7. Jared Grubbs

    Jared Grubbs Administrator Staff Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $20,109
    That is the estimated amount that will be paid out over the next 6 years. So that is a payout from just this tournament. Also, the Big East does not divide the cuts evenly. There is a base plus incentives. Considering Butler earned the 2nd most credits though they are likely at or above that average depending on what the exact incentive are.


    Sent from my iPhone using Butler Hoops mobile app
     
  8. Hinkle

    Hinkle Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $13,960
    Importantly, each year's payouts being dished out over 6 years means we won't be at full financial strength until our 7th year in the BE, when we have 6 tournaments' worth of credits rolling in each year from then on, which should equal something like 1.5 to 2 million per year in tourney money alone.

    (Also, next year is the Horizon League's last year of all that Butler money.)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2016
  9. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
    $9,585
  10. bumba

    bumba Well-Known Member

    Money:
    $10,292
    http://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/college/article73736122.html

    "Ten members of UNC’s 2005 national championship team, for instance, majored in AFAM."

    LOL
     

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