On the Streak

Discussion in 'Butler Basketball' started by PSUButlerFan, Dec 22, 2020.

  1. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

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    Look... I’m going to post something pretty unpopular here, so don’t completely kill me for it. Yes, I’m annoyed/bummed that the streak is over. Butler is garbage this year, and I was happy when the K-State game was canceled (bc even though they got boat raced by some D-II school, they are still a Power 5), so I wasn’t excited about hosting a good SIU team when Butler could have scheduled like IUPUI or someone who isn’t good. In 2020, in this god awful godforsaken year, when Butler is crap, this would have been something to hold on to.

    For those who say “Who cares about the streak”, I do. And others should too. I don’t want this to come across the wrong way, but in the college basketball world, almost nobody cares about Butler. We on this site love it, and there is a small group of alums that do too, but largely Butler is irrelevant (and even more so in the wider sports world). Butler is basically seen as “the cute little small school that overachieved a couple times in the tournament 10 years ago by catching lightning in a bottle with two NBA players and an NBA coach who left them as soon as the right NBA job came along that will never do that again”. Now I don’t think that’s true, but that’s how most people see Butler, if they even see them at all. I have been to four Big East tournament games, and each time multiple people have seen my Butler shirt or jersey and asked me where Butler is located. And these are people coming to watch a tournament of Big East teams!

    Butler has never won the conference, only won one BE tourney game, and has made one Sweet 16 since the UConn title game loss (if memory serves). There isn’t a lot on which to hang their hats.

    But the streak was something really impressive. Butler had by far the most consecutive home non-conference wins. It was an impressive feat that was solely theirs. Something to be talked about. Something that got their logo plastered on TV during other broadcasts. Something fans could brag about. And now it’s over.

    Look, I get it. Butler isn’t beating out IU for a 5-star player because of the streak, but you never know when a player is going to take notice of Butler Bc the streak is mentioned during a primetime Duke game or whomever else might be on. Maybe that kid does a bit of research and likes Butler and becomes the next Kamar Baldwin.

    Yes, this game will help the development of the freshman, and there is a ton to be excited about, but it was nice to answer the Q “where is Butler located” with “Indy, and by the way they hold the current record for most non-conference home wins in a row”. It always makes the asker step back and think, “oh, interesting. I guess I shouldn’t be so ignorant.”
    And now without that, what does Butler have right now? A really bad young team that hopefully improves to where they can make a Sweet 16 and finish top half of their conference in a couple years? We could have had both... The gain in development from losing to SIU vs. beating IUPUI is small and doesn’t outweigh the loss of an accomplishment - a really really impressive one that none of the blue bloods had - that ranked Butler #1 in the college basketball world.

    Just my opinion. Feel free to disagree.
     
  2. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

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    I also think that it was interesting how much the announcers emphasized how little we had been able to practice(Makes sense), when by playing Monday, we chose to once again, not practice.

    From the way our defense plays it’s clear we could use the reps. Situational stuff, repetition for the freshmen, it’s stuff that we need that only practice can provide and we chose not to do it.


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  3. ButlerNut

    ButlerNut Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Shouldn't you start EVERY post with this?

    :confused:
     
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  4. firedupkaren

    firedupkaren Well-Known Member

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    I think the streak was a pretty lame achievement for us to be hanging our hats on. Personally kind of happy its over.


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  5. GodawgsXsucks

    GodawgsXsucks Member

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    How? A lot of quality wins apart of that streak. I’m certainly not happy it’s over.


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  6. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Meh. Home non-conference winning streak doesn't mean much of anything to me. I don't mean to be too dismissive, @PSUButlerFan and hear your point that it was something to hold on to. But it's so meaningless because schools are largely in control of their home non-conference scheduling. The ACC-Big Ten Challenge forcing Syracuse and Duke to occasionally host a decent team is about the only reason those two schools don't have active streaks up into the hundreds.
     
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  7. BUcheer

    BUcheer Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    Bummed it’s over, but not upset about it. Clearly, PSU, you’ve been hanging out with IU fans based on the “lightning in a bottle” rhetoric:)

    It was a unique talking point, but basically just a novelty. And only meaningful for less than half of the season as it’s unlikely to brought up once the noncon wraps up.
     
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  8. Dawgedd

    Dawgedd Well-Known Member

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    The non conference streak is pretty meaningless.

    What brings Butler notoriety: a repeat final 4 run, big east conference championship, big east tournament championship, five star recruits, sustained top 10 rankings. That’s about it.



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  9. PSUButlerFan

    PSUButlerFan Well-Known Member

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    I mean... yes, but Duke lost its streak to Stephen F. Austin :)
     
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  10. ConnersvilleBulldog

    ConnersvilleBulldog Well-Known Member VIP Member

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    I was wondering something along these lines last night. But what is Butler's identity in the current basketball landscape?

    We aren't the scrappy underdog program anymore, with a chip on it's shoulders and incredible attention to detail. But it's not like we are one of those power conference teams that just shows up and wins because it has dudes. We are just kind of in the middle.

    And to be honest, I can't really tell you our offensive or defensive identify either. I know if you watch a game, the announcers are going to say something like: we play smart basketball, find the open man on offense and play tough physical defense. But is that a reality? Or just canned cliches that announcers say based on Butler's past?

    Just something I was thinking about as I watched a team out Butler, Butler last night.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2020
  11. NCJon

    NCJon Well-Known Member VIP Member

    Money:
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    And that was a wonderful night!
     
  12. UDDawg

    UDDawg Well-Known Member

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    It is a fascinating question. I know it was never a realistic option for the university as a whole to turn down bigger conferences, but it makes me wonder every now and then whether the basketball program would ultimately have been better served being the giant fish in a small Horizon League (or even A-10) pond. I feel like we’re in big danger of becoming just another middle-of-the-road high-major (if we even qualify for that, really) program. I’m probably being too harsh, but oh well.
     
  13. ChiDawg3

    ChiDawg3 Active Member

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    I for one care about the streak and wish we could have hung on to it last night. It is one more thing for the team to defend and come together on. It's the little things that teams use to bring out the best in each other. No, nothing to hang a banner about but it still says something. I believe it is what allowed the team to bounce back last night after everything was going God Awful. Achievers need something to shoot for, something to keep alive, because sometimes in retrospect, you find you were able to do more than you ever have or even thought possible when you were just focused on the pursuit.
    Success leaves clues, so I guess a successful program does too. What does a team need to overcome to have a streak like that:
    -An "Off Night"
    -Poor Shooting
    -Players focused on finals
    -Disciplinary Issues
    -Other program distractions
    These are just a few things that come to mind that keeps streaks like these from happening regularly in college basketball. These are college kids with A LOT swirling around them. I'm proud of what we accomplished, wish we could have continued it, and look forward to the next one.
     
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  14. willisbrown

    willisbrown Well-Known Member

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    Moving to the big east and getting FOX and FS1 in our pocket as a conference was the only choice to be made. The exposure it has given our university is priceless. No, we're not the little engine that could anymore but we get every damn game nationally broadcasted and we've had some good success. We're not the scrappy little boys anymore. We are a major program playing in a major conference. With that brings changes. We finally recruited like it last year and the fruits of that are already showing. Just wait til Scooby is ready. I truly believe this program is in transition now that the staff has tasted the real recruiting waters (the top 150 waters). As it transitions there will be some hiccups and some moments where you do wonder where Butler from yesteryear has gone. We're not the same. But we will be better with the ever increasing talent coming aboard. I can't imagine Butler being a meddling program...we should be and we all should expect to be a top half conference team every year going forward. This year just sucks with the injuries, the dumb covid and grades.

    Oh and yes, the cliches used from the announcers are talking points from 10-15 years ago they are just regurgitating.
     
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  15. Dawgedd

    Dawgedd Well-Known Member

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    And I will say that one reason this season leaves me hopeful is that this group of freshman seems to have the pieces to allow us to compete for these championships and make a final4 run. We need (lack of) injury luck, players to hit in next years class, and solid development and we will be right there


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  16. dawgs2014

    dawgs2014 Well-Known Member

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    I think it’s pretty impossible to sustain being the “giant fish in a small pond.” While I don’t disagree that the potential of becoming another middle of the road high major, we’ve padded our fall so that we can never be another middle of the road low or mid major.

    The kids that we are recruiting now were 5 and 6 years old the last time Butler won a sweet 16 game; very few if any remember it, and soon we will be assured that none will.

    I think it’s impossible to ignore that in many ways we have been victims of our own success. In many ways, each bout with success we’ve had has been accompanied by a similarly significant setback; Brad leaving as we entered the Big East, Holtmann leaving with our best class, a great staff and following a Sweet 16 appearance.

    We need more money. We need to be able to ensure that we will be able to not have our coach bought away from us. We cannot fight that there will always be some better opportunities, but we have to be able to get close financially. We also need better assistants, and that’s a budget issue. Right now, we have wal mart assistants trying to compete in the West Elm marketplace. We have less staff, less qualified staff, and likely less effective staff than most of our peers.

    Butler is never going to be for everyone, but the days of being able to coast off of our final four fumes are probably behind us. We need to reinvent ourselves and fully step Into high level college athletics, something I don’t think we’ve done financially or operationally.


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  17. bumba

    bumba Well-Known Member

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    Agree, congratulations on winning years of buy games against teams that didn't make March Madness. Sprinkle in a few good wins against Gonzaga, Florida, Tennessee, etc. and there's your streak.

    The best part if the streak was the year they finally started selling beer in Hinkle.
     
  18. BigHoss

    BigHoss Active Member

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    Absolutely no one outside of this message board knows or cares about “the streak”. It is entirely meaningless. I mean, should we hang a banner for holding serve against a whole bunch of nobodies and Gonzaga?

    If you’re scheduling games simply to keep your name on a graphic that may or may not pop up 10 times a year, you’re doing it wrong.

    We are absolutely awful right now, and I’m not confident in LaVall being the guy to maximize what Butler can be. But this is a non-issue and should be the least of our concerns.
     
  19. firedupkaren

    firedupkaren Well-Known Member

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    It doesn’t MEAN anything. It’s just how the wins and losses on the schedule were randomized.

    I’m curious if this is something the team actually cares about either. I’m not saying they don’t care about winning games at home, they obviously do, but we’re the freshman even aware of the streak heading into last night? That might sound like a dumb question, but it’s just a really irrelevant statistic and I’d be surprised if it were a point of emphasis. Was that game somehow more important than tomorrow’s home game since Providence is in our conference? I’d argue it was far less meaningful.
     
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  20. BigHoss

    BigHoss Active Member

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    The part about assistant coaches is spot on. I’d have a lot more faith in LJ being the guy to take us to the next level, if he were surrounded by a much stronger set of assistant coaches.

    As it currently stands, our staff, top to bottom, is almost laughable. There’s higher level scheme guys and recruiting guys at the high school level. And with LaVall’s inexperience, it just ain’t gonna cut it. Needs to be addressed ASAP, unless we are striving to be a companion for DePaul at the bottom of the conference.
     

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